Arccos Caddie gets Thumbs Up from USGA
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Arccos Caddie gets Thumbs Up from USGA

Arccos Caddie gets Thumbs Up from USGA

If you’re a player who gets giddy at the idea advanced analytics and leveraging this information during stipulated tournament rounds, the announcement made by the USGA this week is an early Christmas gift.

Specifically, the USGA provided some clarification regarding the use of Arccos’ Caddie feature which is an add-on, subscription-based service which augments the Arccos 360 platform.

So long as the player uses the “Arccos Restricted” app and a local rule is in place allowing the use of distance measuring devices, all is above board.

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The USGA rationale states because this app “is incapable of gauging or measuring any parameter other than distance, use of the Arccos Caddie application in conjunction with the Arccos 360 application, as submitted, has been evaluated and it has been determined that the use of the Arccos Caddie application is permitted under the Rules of Golf when a Committee establishes a Local Rule permitting the use of distance measuring devices (see Decision 14-3/0.5). ” 

There are, however, elements in this decision which are worth a closer look and will likely be the subject of ongoing conversation and debate.

Recommendations offered by the Arccos caddie currently apply only to the tee shot, and tell the player percentage likelihood of hitting the fairway, missing the fairway (right and left) as well as an expected score based on previous rounds. It also provides generic suggestions how the optimally play the remainder of the hole, which I wouldn’t guess is significantly different than something such as “a layup short and left of the water hazard gives the best approach to the heavily bunkered green.” That said, ruling bodies have been cautious to allow anything which takes decision-making and skill out of players’ hands, and one could argue this infringes on that unstated, yet often practiced belief.

ARCCOS1-4

The restricted app does not produce new information based on shots played during that round (and therefore possibly breach rule 14-3), but as a player enters more rounds (where all the caddie features can be utilized), the suggestions become more accurate (statistically significant). Moreover, there’s going to be questions of how would a player in violation of this decision be noticed by competitors. The game is rooted in values such as integrity and honesty and players routinely call penalties on themselves, but it seems a rule-making body would also want to make sure decisions are clear, succinct and easily enforceable.

Also, as Arccos improves the platform and adds features (potentially opening the door to Arccos AI generated recommendations within the field of play), will this decision need to be revised or is artificial intelligence indicative of an entirely new conversation necessitating something more than a single USGA decision?

The USGA doesn’t exactly have a reputation as a forward-thinking entity, and because it often reacts, rather than anticipates, it’s reasonable to think companies like Arccos will stay at least several steps ahead, which makes one wonder who exactly is writing the rules?

So, what do you make of this decision? Like it? Loathe it? Tell us.

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Chris Nickel

Chris Nickel

Chris Nickel

Chris is a self-diagnosed equipment and golf junkie with a penchant for top-shelf ice cream. When he's not coaching the local high school team, he's probably on the range or trying to keep up with his wife and seven beautiful daughters. Chris is based out of Fort Collins, CO and his neighbors believe long brown boxes are simply part of his porch decor. "Isn't it funny? The truth just sounds different."

Chris Nickel

Chris Nickel

Chris Nickel

Chris Nickel

Chris Nickel

Chris Nickel

Chris Nickel

Chris Nickel

Chris Nickel





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      DRMock1

      6 years ago

      I don’t get why the USGA is so hesitant to allow the use of these type of apps. I play some local tournaments and don’t use a caddie. When you watch the PGA caddies they provide a lot of information like; distance, wind, elevation change, club selection, trouble spots, and slope. These apps can help provide this information for the rest of us!

      Reply

      Birdieputt13

      6 years ago

      The difference is that Tour caddies actually go out and walk, plot and measure the course by foot and during the round are only permitted to use their written notes for their measurements.

      Reply

      TR1PTIK

      6 years ago

      Reading through the comments I can only guess that everyone bemoaning the technological advancements provided by Arccos (or Game Golf or 18 Birdies or any one of a million other apps) also have a problem with the anchored putting ban, the box groove ban, and the idea that the modern golf ball should be rolled back. Sound about right? Do you we not all enjoy the technological advancements that gave us high MOI drivers and putters, irons that launch higher and fly farther than their predecessors, or golf balls that add more yards to your long game and more spin for your short game?

      I don’t own Arccos (I’d like to, but I don’t have the money and I’m in no hurry since I already own a Game Golf device). What these systems provide (Arccos and Game Golf are in fact complete systems and not just an app BTW) is an easy way for average golfers to collect and review data from actual rounds played on a golf course in hopes that they will recognize the areas of their game that need the most work.

      The caddie feature Arccos developed is simply an extension of that and merely suggests how a golfer MIGHT want to play a hole based on data collected during previous rounds.

      The USGA decision actually limits the usefulness of this feature (caddie feature) to just the tee shot. Meanwhile, anyone on tour (or anyone at a course providing yardage books and/or caddies) have access to similar information provided by different means for all shots.

      How can this not only be a good thing for amateur golf really? Do you realize how much time it takes to record and compile this data by hand? Do you really want to wait on the guy marking up his scorecard trying to remember what club he hit, how far it went, the result, and what the lie was?

      You’d also be remiss to not recognize the implications of such devices from a teaching perspective. My local PGA doesn’t always have time to go out on the course with me and see how I actually play but I can show him every shot I’ve ever hit through these “apps”.

      If you want to gripe about technology on the course, I suggest you sell your range finders, your 460cc high MOI drivers, long putters, and hybrids. Go buy a set of hickory shafted clubs, a gutta-percha ball, and build your tees from sand instead. Otherwise, you’re just a hypocrite and a sour-puss.

      Reply

      James T.

      6 years ago

      Am I allowed to anchor my Arccos?

      Reply

      Steve S

      6 years ago

      I’m all for any technology that brings out more golfers and can improve their “fun quotient”. If you like it great, if not don’t use it. It’s like all the new drivers. If it makes you happy to buy a new driver every year, go for it.

      Reply

      10shot

      6 years ago

      Well said

      Reply

      Dave

      6 years ago

      Why do we need this to play golf ? What next ?

      Reply

      Smitty

      6 years ago

      Jack, Trevino, Player, Couples, Floyd – only time they look at the ” Sky & Caddie ” was to check for wind ;)

      If the USGA says it’s good, then it’s all good!

      Reply

      David

      6 years ago

      It seems to me that the Arccos app isn’t really much different then the app I use for yardage on my phone. It’s free from play store. It won’t tell me how or what club to use but for extra money I believe it does . Is all this some sort of promo for Arccos and USGA? For me it seems pretty simple. Use if you choose for all.

      Reply

      Fish

      6 years ago

      I’m assuming that all the guys bashing this app don’t use a sky caddie or laser correct? if Can’t hit the shot there is no amount of data that is going to help you. The one comment about hitting the range and figuring out the yardage’s for each club and shot dispersion. Are you doing that with a Trackman? I have practiced on quite a few nice ranges there isn’t one that I would trust to figure out distances.

      If there is an app that will make the anyone enjoy this great game more I’m all for it. Rounds continue to decline in my area the less the course makes either the green fees go up and the conditions of the course go down. As far as speed of play gimme a break guys get out there with there lasers or sky caddies and take for ever with both.

      Reply

      OTG

      6 years ago

      I used Arccos and have found the stats very useful. I have not tried the caddy function yet, but knowing it is approved I will be likely giving it a try.

      Reply

      Nick D

      6 years ago

      It would be nice if the Android app worked.

      Reply

      Uhit

      6 years ago

      I don´t think, that this will speed up play…

      Reply

      spyaddict

      6 years ago

      100% okay

      Reply

      TBT

      6 years ago

      I have used the Arccos caddie feature during my “free” preview and honestly I’m struggling to decide wether or not I’m going to pay for the added feature, I just haven’t used it that much.

      I think part of the issue is that I’m not used to getting my phone out during the round. I just got used to keeping it in my pocket, so now I need to get used to checking it during the round. I haven’t really used the GPS feature since I have a laser. I love the stats and analytics it provides but I need to work Arccos more into my pre-shot routine to get the most out of it,

      Reply

      Raymond CHASTEL

      6 years ago

      I don’t agree with all these so called “modernities “which claim to help you in your daily life ,but which in reality makes it unduly complicated .I have shelved my mobile phone and enjoy not being harassed any more .I play a pretty good golf game at age 83 -handicap 7-three times a week ,all year round ,and don’t see the necessity or the need of being told how I should play any golf course ,my eyes and my mind know perfectly well what I should do .
      Il this modern world ,nobody tries or is too lazy to make their mind work .What would they do if they were lost in the SAHARA desert without an i phone ,a GPS or a compass..Could they find there way by the stars ?

      Reply

      Chris Nickel

      6 years ago

      Raymond,
      Fortunately, no one is forcing you to use or purchase said “modernities” and the idea that a piece of technology could take away some element of decision making and skill is a concern many have voiced. Technology isn’t a one-way street, but I always wonder whether those making claims such as “everyone is lazy” etc. own a microwave…or drive to the golf course…or logged on to a computer to post on a message board.

      Reply

      Plaidjacket

      6 years ago

      My Jaw wasn’t dropped when I read the article about Arccos caddie feature. Chris wants to defend his article. That’s fine. But in his response to Raymond who has a counter opinion; Chris introduces us to a few Straw Men in attempt to bolster his story. I own a microwave but don’t need one to make my decision on what to eat. I own a car but my car isn’t making my decision on which route to take. I also own a computer to post on a message board which has nothing to do with equating said Straw Men Chris uses. But since I can’t walk over to see Chris and have this discussion in person I suppose I’m also Lazy. Bottom line is use Arccos if you want to and have a nice day. If you’re lost in the Sahara I hope you can get a signal on your Phone. If not you’re boned! Perhaps I better learn how to read the stars just in case.

      Stephen DiBari

      6 years ago

      Well said. I play off a 4.5 handicap USGA and Ive had Arcoss 360 since spring of this year and logged about 21 rounds with it. Like the stats it gives me, specifically the club distances, putts in GIR and overall putts. Nothing short of brilliant. Like the idea of the “caddie” feature. Looking forward to next season with it, this will make my round more enjoyable and create more confidence on the tee box, especially if I’m playing a new course. If nothing else, this will speed up play

      Dave S

      6 years ago

      Cool rant, but if you’re lost in the Sahara, even if you’re the best star-reader in the history of mankind, you’re toast.

      Reply

      Jess Robinson

      6 years ago

      Raymond, for what it’s worth-
      I’m 35. I am communicating to everyone (and everything) reading this through my iPhone. I have a compass on my phone, but I would be dead by virtue of being a white male in the Sahara traveling North through Libya, or Egypt. Depends on where my point of entrance was.

      On the other hand, I put my phone on mute at work (My vocation is Golf), only check messages from my Wife, Father or Colleague, I put my phone away and out of site whilst on the course, I use it for video while teaching, and I will never allow it to become my caddie or comrade.

      Reply

      Adam

      6 years ago

      This one is tough. I love the idea as a game improvement/practice tool. However, bringing it into tournament play is interesting. Especially as the technology develops.
      That said, it could also be a hindrance to some players as they’ll rely too much on the technology and not account for other variables.
      I haven’t pulled the trigger on Arccos yet because I’ve been spending my dollars on clubs. However, I am hoping to possibly get it as a Christmas gift. If I do, I’ll defintely be utilizing this feature.

      Reply

      Dave

      6 years ago

      Arccos claims that their “Tournament Mode” complies with the USGA suggested local rule:
      “Yes, you can turn on Tournament Mode. This will show you only the features of Arccos Caddie that conform to the Rules of Golf – including display of your optimal strategy, wind speed and wind direction.”
      The USGA Decision specifically DISallows any device that indicates wind. ARCCOS may need to review this to make it properly compliant.

      Reply

      James T.

      6 years ago

      What is there to keep me from checking a weather app on my phone to ascertain the direction and speed of the wind?

      Reply

      Max

      6 years ago

      Ok guys here is my take on the subject. I have a problem with distance so in order to play a better game I have taken to the practice area. I have hit a number of balls with each club to find out which club I need
      to hit for each distance from the green. Each club has it average distance from the green. I use a gps to get the averages. The way I figure it is if a pro golfer can carry a book so can I. If my gps reads
      75 yards to the pin I use the 75 yard iron.

      Reply

      10shot

      6 years ago

      You bring up a very good point, yardage books. Not much different

      Merry Christmas.

      Reply

      Mark J

      6 years ago

      I think a lot of people are missing the point here. The Arccos is just acting as a combination of a caddie and his notebook. A pro and their caddie will spend hours hitting shots and collecting yardage and all that other data that is increasingly (whether you like it or not) relied upon these days. Us mere mortals don’t have time for that and in reality a lot of our data is gathered on course. If I wanted to document my shot outcomes on course, by hand, it’d slow play down no end. This thing does it automatically and instantly then does all the crunching to provide feedback. It doesn’t make you do anything, you still have free will. I really hope some of the know it all’s on here try it, ignore the layup advice and then their phone says “told you so” when their ball goes swimming…

      Reply

      trevor

      6 years ago

      love it, lol

      Reply

      Chander

      6 years ago

      Hi MAGS folks
      May I and many of my friends request you to do a rating on best golf books to read and best golf video s to learn golf.

      This will get more new golfers to join MGS.

      Your club ratings are the best ,even much better than Golf Digest in my opinion.

      Thanks
      Chander

      Reply

      Ken

      6 years ago

      Based upon the responses thus far, it’s time to ban caddies for the pros and on public/private courses. Any kid can carry a bag, clean clubs, and tend a pin. All other caddie activities are simply manual extensions of this app.

      Ever seen a pro stand on the course or green with their caddie, reading their yardage books, debating how to play the course? THAT doesn’t slow down play??

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhknFgI8tJY

      Reply

      Bob L.

      6 years ago

      I like making my own decisions. HOWEVER, when this app is available in a skycaddy like device, and always on during the round, pace of play would greatly improve and help get more golfers to enjoy the game and camaraderie that daily fee courses and clubs provide to their customers. Eventually, these “new” users will learn to make their own decisions, and not gum up play during their first years of playing.

      Reply

      Robert

      6 years ago

      Just a question for all the people bashing this. What is the difference between this and having a caddy? Aside from one being a person and another being a computer? The computer will actually be faster than a person in the club selection. Look at it as just a personal caddy that can’t read greens.

      Reply

      Smitty

      6 years ago

      No disagreement there it will be faster to access just like Google can access everything.

      A very good point, seemingly exactly the same way that our jobs are being eliminated. Other wuse know as advancements in technology.

      Good point well taken.

      Reply

      Kenny B

      6 years ago

      Another dumb move by the USGA. I can understand using the Arccos system during practice play to help in understanding your game, but not during competition. If it does basically the same thing as DMDs, then use those. I can see that this will ultimately help to slow the game down even more #paceofplay. I can only imagine that one day while someone is using this and their phone goes dead, they will stand there and wonder what to do, what to do!! They might still be there after dark because their phone didn’t tell them it was time to go home! lol

      Reply

      10shot

      6 years ago

      I hear what u say, keep this in mind.
      When I shot semi pro archery for over 25 years, it didnt take to long to figure out who paid for my purse and free gear. It wasnt other semi or full pros, it was the average crappy slow archer.
      We need to bring the new app happy, electronic welding, kids on board. May be that will save our game and put money in the cash registers. Remember, ur private club wont survive if the masses stop golfing.
      Merry Christmas

      Reply

      Carolina Golfer 2

      6 years ago

      Saw this briefly last year at their booth. I am anxious to get another look at it next month. Having USGA is a huge deal for the product, in my opinion.

      Reply

      Dan

      6 years ago

      This product would definitely take away from the mental aspects of the game and slow play to less than a snail’s pace. Too much tech in the wrong place does more harm than good. Leave it for the computer games.

      Reply

      Regis

      6 years ago

      Might actually speed play up. I have no interest in it but your criticism (which is fair) is the same criticism that was initially leveled at GPS devices. Now it’s rare to see a golfer hunting for a yardage marker and pacing off the distance to his ball

      Reply

      Aivo

      6 years ago

      I’m going on 72 with a 5 handicap playing an average of 2 times per week spending a lot of time in my back yard hitting short irons thru wedges. I don’t see a lot of golfers pacing off distances from the markers which would slow down play greatly. If you have played for any time you should be able to guesstimate distances fairly accurately. and on top of that how many of us are so distance consistent the being out by even 5 yards makes and difference in the end result. I know it’s against the rules but we share distance info on the course to keep the game going. What we don’t do is tell each other what club to hit nor whether to lay-up or go for it! I think I’m the best judge of how I hit the clubs from day to day and can’t see using some averaging artificial intelligence.

      Mr. Frog

      6 years ago

      Personally, I think that if you need this sort of app to play golf (either better or as good as without it) then you best be spending more time at the range. Learning your “true” distances (where the ball ends up after roll, your shot dispersion, and what kind of shots you can actually hit are going to help you down the road much more than relying on an app.

      I can see using this app at a new course (if you are someone who plays at a lot of unfamiliar courses) but once you play somewhere once, you start to build up course knowledge which is 100x more important than this app.

      Reply

      Rich

      6 years ago

      Amen! Spend more time in practice will help ,but some people can’t walk and chew gum at the same time so the next thing will be a CaddyShack Putter that Rodney Dangerfield used .. This device will not help speed up play because it won’t make you a straight shooter!!!! What would help is to play ready golf ,by that I mean one should already have an idea what the yardage should be, get off the cart select a club and hit it BAM!!!! As I go down the course toward the green I look for yardage markers and can get a good estimate of the distance to the center of the green. Avg golfers should always aim for the center of the green usually.. How many avg Joe golfers can or will choke down on a club to subtract distance or try to alter the height of the shot ? NOT MANY we all want to Grip it and Rip It.. To Play faster stop killing time play Ready Golf..

      Reply

      KMERCIER

      6 years ago

      Not sure how being on the range is going to help you find your “True” distances. I know that at my course there is no going on the the range to see where you shots are finishing. I use the Arccos app, although not the caddie portion. I find the information gathered on the course is much more accurate than what i see on the range. Sure i can laser a flag on the range and have a pretty good idea. but this information is a lot more accurate and relevant in a pressure type environment.

      All that being said the Arccos system is not a perfect system, but i sure appreciate the data that it collects, with quite frankly very little effort

      Reply

      TR1PTIK

      6 years ago

      You do realize that’s what Arccos does right? Arccos is primarily used to collect data from on course play so players know how they actually perform on the course and know their REAL yardages, not the fictional yardages that some ranges provide. The caddie FEATURE of the app is just that. A FEATURE. The player has full control over whether or not to use it.

      Also, the app helps with course knowledge by remembering things that most golfers would forget – especially on a course they don’t play often.

      Reply

      Nick

      6 years ago

      I’m more excited by this as a practice tool, simply being conditioned to make better decisions in non competition rounds will help a golfer to make better decisions naturally when they don’t have the tool to hand. I’m not a fan of such tools during competition as it slows play down as people look at all their contraptions

      Reply

      KM

      6 years ago

      Will it tell me to aim at the right greenside bunker to allow for my 20 yard PULL? NO! Will it tell me how to choke down on my 130 yard 5 iron shot? NO! Its useless.

      Reply

      Matt

      6 years ago

      You may not be aware, but the tone of your post has a lot of emotion (I’m picking up anger, but that could be my deriving that from your calling Arccos “useless”). I hope I’m not coming off as overly critical; just wanted you to know that the good points in your post may be overlooked because of the intensity of your writing.

      For sure, in terms of the game of golf, Arccos is tracking only 2 dimensions of the game. It would be cool to see it start to pick up on chipping and punch shots. You should email Arccos. They have been really responsive to me.

      So far, I’ve been a big fan of Arccos. I got it for my Dad, and we use them as golf journals for when we play together. It’s great to be able to recall times we would have otherwise forgotten.

      My point being: there is more to it than shot recommendations. Hope you have a great weekend, KM.

      Reply

      10shot

      6 years ago

      It may get more kids to golf. Thats a good thing right, irs about the game not us
      Merry Christmas

      Reply

      Matt

      6 years ago

      I love using the Arccos Caddie. It helps me plan out both my course management, as well as what I should probably focus on at the range. It is similar to why I like a more bladed iron. The feedback.

      Anyone that thinks that playing with the Caddie as removing the human element has every right to that opinion. I would fervently disagree with said opinion, but, then, the Caddie system and all technology in golf is not for everyone. When it comes down to it, a laser scope or watch is providing almost the same thing.

      I look at the Caddie this way: it is doing what I SHOULD be doing, but won’t because I don’t want to hold up play. It tracks my shots, with distance, and builds averages. It calculates that data (again, averages that I could collect on my own), and suggests a club.

      Just like applying math and to any situation, you can use it to your advantage, or ignore it and play by feel. Life doesn’t demand extremes, and… well I was about to leave the subject of golf.

      Anyway, I’m happy to see this move. Now they need to come up with a Caddie app for Caddies, so they can Caddie while they caddie.

      Reply

      Andrew Han

      6 years ago

      We are so far from an actual AI. This caddie app looks to me a statistically probability based on past data points. It’s nice, but I think a human caddie can render better decisions. Not sure if the app takes into account your current play. Our phones don’t have a full fledged sensory like an actual person does. In any case, got to start somewhere or we go nowhere.

      With that said, I agree there is still a human element with this app, since the player needs to trust and go with the decision made by the program. Otherwise, no point of getting a recommendation.

      I like the human caddie element, just because one they can give you a better recommendation or they can give the wrong decision. It creates the drama, like watching a pitcher and its catcher in a baseball game.

      Reply

      Matt

      6 years ago

      Whoa, I think I must have given the wrong impression (or perhaps I’m misinterpreting your reply). I would NEVER want to replace a human caddie with any type of virtual assistant (obviously including the “Arccos Caddie”).

      If I had access to a human caddie… well, that’s kind of the point of the Arccos system. It is no where close to a human caddie, and it can still definitely help my game.

      Hope that clears things up.

      Andrew Han

      6 years ago

      Don’t get me wrong, I think an actual AI caddie would be cool to have. I would still rule it out during tournament play for PGA pros to have that drama, however.

      I read your comment as if Arccos caddie was complete, hence I started the response with the current status of AI or lack of.

      These system doesn’t determine if the shot was a full shot, partial shot, mishit, and so forth. I could be wrong, but it just takes an average of your shots. I bought game golf within my first year of golf, thinking it will help me with my distance and area to improve. I was too inconsistent at the time for the device to help, and it didn’t give any useful insights. I take it back, it told me I sucked with my wedge and long irons lol.

      I do agree having this, game golf, shot tracker, or any other similar devices will help. It will help what to work on at the range or home. We got to start somewhere or go nowhere.

      Kevin Burke

      6 years ago

      This technology reminds me of the adage…”just because technically you can do something…doesn’t mean you should”.

      If you really need an app to tell you to lay up on a certain hole, your golfing brain has ceased to function. Now we all lose our mind on the course and make stupid decisions in going for a green when we shouldn’t, or not using a three wood off the tee when it is a better option, but I really can’t fathom needing to whip out my cell phone to be “TOLD” what is my best option.

      It is annoying enough when people around you have their head stuck in a phone. Now we are going to watch a golfer get on the tee and look at his phone for yardage and advice before pulling the trigger on a hole he may have played hundreds of times? He needs all that data to pull the club back? That should speed the game up and make it more social.

      How about learning to PLAY the game and not be robotic about everything. Develop a feel for the game. Experiment and have fun with the game. Will we need an app to tell us wither to hit a lob shot, pitch it low and check, or hit a little runner?

      All this technology with clubs and apps and GPS and yet I bet the average amateur doesn’t score much better now than he/she did 10 years ago.

      To each his own but I say put the phone down, enjoy and learn naturally from every round and have some fun out there. It’s a game, not a balance sheet.

      The USGA allows at least part of the Arcoss technology. Another confusing ruling by the games governing body.

      Reply

      Tim

      6 years ago

      This kind of golf should only be play in an arcade!

      Reply

      Joe Mandola

      6 years ago

      Not for me. I want to step up to my next shot knowing I am going to pull it off to my mind’s eye

      Reply

      Devon Rohl

      6 years ago

      Arccos is a great product, and really helped my game! I really like reviewing a new course before I play it, and seeing what I should be playing. I bought the caddy app, but don’t regularly use it…. don’t like looking at my phone all the time.

      Reply

      Jeff

      6 years ago

      Same with me, sent them back. Work about half the time.

      Reply

      Spongy5

      6 years ago

      Had an opponent complain that my partner had these on his clubs. Even after Club Pro appoved it but let final decision up to our playing partners they still wanted them removed. We beat them in 19 holes to advance. #Karma

      Reply

      Rich

      6 years ago

      I believe this is taking the thinking and decision making process of what is the wise thing to assure you have x% of making this shot. What makes golf fun is your selection of what to use and where to play the shot .The decision made (Risk /Reward) should be make without a program (Computer ) making your decision .. This isn’t golf , it’s becoming ROBOT golf in a manner. The human thinking IS the major part of the game.

      Reply

      Bignose

      6 years ago

      So, on the one hand, this level of information is the kind of prep work that is becoming commonplace on the tour (and the Arccos tech trying to bring it to the ‘common man’). But that kind of information still only works on averages and normalized conditions.

      The player still has to evaluate the current conditions, still has to evaluate the wind, the lie, how they are swinging the club that day, etc. The player still has to execute. In fact, at the top levels, I suspect that there is no information that a system like this could give that wasn’t already known at least as the game is in 2017. Now, if you want to talk about returning the game to a state many years ago without even yardage books and the players need to be able to evaluate distances by eye, etc., that could be interesting too. But I am not sure you get that genie back in the bottle; this kind of analytics is in every single sport anywhere now. And if having this stuff written down and getting distances faster results in the guys overall playing faster, then I am all for that.

      Reply

      Chris Nickel

      6 years ago

      Rich – I think this is where some grey area starts to creep in to the conversation. On one hand, I can see your point and the USGA has stated it isn’t moved by the idea of removing skill/decision making from players, but on the other hand, how much “pure” decision making have we already allowed to be taken out of players hands? Yardage books marked with every conceivable distance – green reading books – apps which calculate “plays like” distances based on elevation, barometric pressure, temp etc. which can be used to mark said yardage books – Caddies lining players up for putts and so on….

      Point being, players still have to execute the shot and no amount of information is going to change that –

      Reply

      David W

      6 years ago

      Most of us know the smart play without having an app, we just make the wrong decision. The app isn’t making the decision for us so I’m not seeing much of a difference in that respect.

      Reply

      Scott

      6 years ago

      Hope it works better for them, as I returned mine. I can’t wait to see all the pga players playing with their smart phones in the front pockets.

      Reply

      Chris Nickel

      6 years ago

      Scott – This technology is subject to the same USGA decision as DMD’s (rangefinders, etc) – I don’t know of any tour events which allow those and tour players already have access to a caddie – that’s not the target market. It’s the other 97% or so of players who don’t have regular access to caddie.

      Reply

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