An Insider’s Look at Big Box Golf Retail
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An Insider’s Look at Big Box Golf Retail

An Insider’s Look at Big Box Golf Retail

Written By: Jay Baker

Let’s face it, not too many people out there truly love their jobs. That is one main reason people get into the golf business – so that they can do something they love. Once golf becomes a job, however, the love leaves quickly. Working for a golf big box retailer can squash the love of the game faster than most anything else.

One of the goals of MyGolfSpy is to provide the consumer with an inside look at every aspect of the golf equipment business. Educating the general public and calling for more transparency within the industry is the best way to knock down the institutional barriers that inhibit the growth of the game. It is in that spirit that we take an inside look at what it’s like to work in a golf big box retail environment through the eyes of a former employee. What we describe today is taking place at each and every one of golf’s big box retailers.

For this article, we interviewed a former big box store employee who amicably left his company after 8 years of service. In order to protect our sources, some details and names have been changed. We will call our chief subject “Henry” and as you will see working for a big box retailer isn’t as fun as some might believe it is.

Here’s what you need to know.

Golf Companies Make the Rules

Make no mistake about it; the major OEMs have carefully crafted their strategies for selling golf clubs. Henry first tells us that stores have little control over what product they are sent. Need more right-handed 9.5 stiff drivers? Too bad, you’re going to get the configurations that manufacturers want to send, and many will just sit on the shelf and eat up floor space that could be used for more popular models. Don’t have a real need for left-handed or woman’s clubs? Too bad, you have take those as well. We will touch on this later but this mismanagement of ordering really screws up inventory.

Another way that some manufacturers contribute to market oversaturation is to force stores to take on extra inventory before the end of the year in order to help boost their own numbers. This happens more than you would think and it’s not just a big box problem smaller shops have to deal with this as well.

Believe it or not, it isn’t just the publicly traded golf OEMs either. Privately owned golf companies have been known to play this shell game as well. The companies will unload clubs to the stores in November or December and then take back whatever doesn’t sell for a special credit in January. The losses simply get moved to the next calendar year in hopes to make up for it in the 1st and 2nd quarter. It’s a legal way to cook the books.

Demo Clubs are A Debacle

One of the most important aspects of the big box environment is that they have massive amounts of demos available to try in their indoor hitting bays. Typically, the OEMs send the demos well after the stock has hit the shelves. That means every Tom, Dick, and Harry will pull the stock item, inadequately tape it up, and fire away in the simulator until the club is considered “well loved”.

demo club

As MyGolfSpy has discussed in previous article, this unfortunate consequence of the selling process makes it impossible to sell the club at full retail price; however, it does put the retailer in the position of needing to order more new inventory from the OEMs. Sneaky, right?

It should be noted that not all OEMs handle their demo programs the same way. Some make the stores purchase their demos while others loan the demos/fitting carts to the stores.

Demo clubs become like the village bicycle. Several OEMs will not take back the demos/fitting carts if they have been ridden hard and left out wet to dry. This becomes a real problem because over the course of a season, demos get stolen, lost, or broken. The OEMs know this and use it to their advantage because the primary source of all three of these problems is the adjustable hosel.

First, the ability to quickly change heads and shafts is to thieves like the ability for a toddler to pick their nose; the finger fits perfectly (evolution, yay!).

Second, the inventory process is basically as inefficient as it possibly could be. Toss in the ability for anyone to change a club from its original SKU (mix and match heads and shafts) and the inventory control process becomes futile.

Finally, Henry tells us that adjustable hosels have increased club failures by upwards of 15% for store demos.

adjustability-nwm-1

Every OEM has issues in this particular area. Some are willing to address the issues directly, while others insist any problems are isolated failures. How a given OEM responds to these problems is what defines its customer service.

Henry won’t single out any brand.  Every OEM has their good qualities and bad qualities.  Where one excels the others may slip into more sleaze with product release cycles.

I know what you’re thinking; “here we go again with the product cycle dead horse.” Henry would like you to consider his point of view; short product cycles eliminate the opportunity for the retailer to provide the highest level of customer service. “Products can’t always be exchanged”, Henry says. “Several times a week, customers would come in with broken heads, shafts, or whatever that could not be replaced because the model was already 6 months old and discontinued”.

Sure, the good OEMs will replace the club with a comparable model but that’s not always the best answer when you consider iron sets or matching shafts.

Short product cycles can be a customer service killer.

You know what else can be a customer service killer? The customers…

Customers Are Their Own Worst Enemies

fitting

Henry tells us there is about a 50/50 good to bad ratio for the customers. Most customers fit into some category of stereotype. The country club guys want to be treated like they are at “the club”. They never trust a sales associate and their pro is always right.

Normal Joe Golfer will allow peer pressure to trump sound advice from a sales associate. If his buddies have it, so should he.

Gear head hacker guy wants MOI matched swing weight, but can’t break triple digits.

Counterfeit guy swears his clubs are legit after buying them online for pennies on the dollar from an overseas Alibaba or maybe even a big box store in China. Henry says he would see that “guy” in some fashion a minimum of ten times a month. Most of these guys don’t reveal their true selves until it’s time for the fitting.

Often golfers know just enough to be dangerous. The numbers generated by a launch monitor or simulator might as well be the Voynich Manuscript to most costumers. If they do pay attention to one factor, says Henry, it is club head speed.

“Customers will latch onto club head speed like it is the end all be all to their golf game. Who cares that the last shot didn’t even touch the impact tape on the face? Big boy just registered 90+ with the driver.” – Henry

People can be their own worst enemy in fittings. A particular driver or setup might be the best thing for a golfer but they allow bias and pre-conceived notions to creep in that affect how they swing a golf club.

Henry says the best way to get fit is not to look at logos or specs and just trust that the fitter is competent. Ultimately, the numbers won’t lie if the customers are honest with themselves.

The most infamous fitting Henry was ever involved in ended with an older gentleman deciding to ditch his left-handed clubs in favor or right-handed clubs. After years of terrible golf, the customer was convinced that playing from the wrong side caused his woes.

Henry had fit the gentleman several times before, but couldn’t believe it when he asked for all new clubs in the right-handed version. By learning to play the game from scratch, he was able to avoid certain bad habits he had created on the left-handed side of the golf ball. Golfers, as most of you know, often find creative solutions to their problems.

Corporate Overlords are out of touch with the troops on the ground

corporate-overlord

Henry never knew too much about the day to day happenings at headquarters, but he believes HQ did an excellent job at creating its own problems. Employees weren’t offered any sort of incentive program or even any sort of formal training.

Every once in a while an OEM would run a sales contest, but spiffing was strictly prohibited. HQ also made it difficult for existing employees to climb the corporate ladder within the company. If an employee wasn’t willing to up and move at a moments notice, getting promoted to a manager position was impossible. Employees were keenly aware that if they didn’t go anywhere, they weren’t going anywhere.

That’s not a great way to promote employee retention and maintain your most valuable human assets within a store.

Henry was disappointed that even after 8 years of services, his corporate contact never called to wish him luck or to say thanks after he told his superiors he was changing careers.

Henry says that other than being overlooked as an employee, inventory might have been the worst part of the job. Corporate preached the importance of inventory, but would never invest any money in developing a proper inventory process. They tried multiple solutions, but never could get it right.

Lost prevention was another issue at the forefront, and obviously that has a direct tie in to inventory. Loss was calculated based on sales from each respective location. As you will realize shortly, theft is a HUGE problem.

We asked Henry what could corporate do to improve the business from the floor level perspective.  Henry believes that his former employer is ultimately on the right track, but the execution of the retail vision is lacking. He said that regional distribution centers could help service and inventory, not unlike how Cabela’s and Bass Pro Shop currently operate.

This would also improve transfers, which were a total nightmare. Henry also believes that big box stores should pressure OEMs to come up with packaging similar to Callaway’s i-Mix experiment.

While selling heads and shafts separately didn’t take off for Callaway at the time, Henry thinks this will help prevent theft, broken clubs, and associated inventory issues.

It’s much harder to steal a head in anti-theft packaging.

How bad is the theft problem at big box retailers? It’s the #1 problem.

Customers will steal anything

Hide your drivers, hide your wedges, hide your balls, hide your wife, and hide your kids, because they are stealing everything.

There is a long list of how it happens.  Let’s start with the customers. Henry tells us he saw it all. Pipe cutters were popular. Thieves would simply cut the shafts just below the hosel and pocket the heads. The process is quick, easy, and discrete. Other customers would simply stick the club down their pants and walk out.

By far, the most popular method of theft is to swap shafts or heads inside the hitting bay. A customer comes in with his or her own club, goes to the hitting bay, and discretely uses the store provided wrench to swap out his 913 D3 for the new 915 D3. This is where individual packaging would help. Demos would still be vulnerable but at least the customers wouldn’t be stealing new clubs.

Employees Steal Too

Reducing customer theft won’t completely solve the issue. Henry estimates that 25% of the club theft in stores comes from the employees. A few employees have been caught faking pre-owned trade-ins to get credit on a gift card. All the employee would have to do is write up a bogus trade-in receipt and file it. They could then come back and buy products to sell themselves or just sell the gift card outright.

The reason this works is because the used club section has no inventory, only a dollar value of the inventory being held in that particular store.

There is no system that validates that the used Scotty Cameron putter which was just traded in actually exists.

theft-infographic

Clubs are just the start. One of the more dubious acts of theft he witnessed didn’t involve taking clubs, but rather good old fashion credit card fraud. Henry describes a cashier, who liked to return things during slow times at the check out line. Clothes, balls, clubs, and range finders were all returned on her credit card.

The problem was that the items were never actually purchased in the first place. As you might imagine, over time, the returns added up. By the time managers and corporate got wise to the scheme, the employee had had amassed tens of thousands of dollars in returns.

Needless to say she was fired and taken to court.

Are Big Changes Coming to Big Box?

Corporate overlords who just don’t seem to get it, customers who also just don’t seem to get it, and of course lowlife thieves; these are unpleasant realities in most any retail business.

Better employee incentive programs, better consumer information, and better packaging (coupled with public executions) may help alleviate some of these problems, but none of them can realistically be eliminated.

The biggest chance for meaningful improvement for little guys and big box alike comes from the OEMs. The golf companies need to do a better job supporting their retail partners. For what it’s worth, I think most of them now realize that needs to happen for everyone to be successful.

While nobody has yet been overly-specific about what that actually means, every golf company we’ve spoken with is talking about the need to be more responsible about how much product they produce. Inventory control has nearly replaced Loft Up, and something-Bertha-something as the industry’s buzzphrase du jour.

Restrained production and this new commitment to not bending retail partners over the proverbial barrel might actually eliminate the 4-6 month full price lifecycle for brands that believe there’s still success to be found in accelerated product releases. Because, believe me, if some golf companies slow down their releases, it’s not going to be by much.

We think that will ultimately take the form of more controlled (and realistic) inventory levels, more durable pricing (which means retailers will maintain consistent margins), and fewer blowout pricing opportunities for the consumer.

It’s going to mean higher prices and fewer discounts for the consumer, but it also means a healthier bottom line for both retailers and the golf companies.

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      Vantage Tag

      3 years ago

      You think golf equipment is expensive!
      Every time my kid breaks a hockey stick, I say out loud “there goes another driver or putter”.
      BWT times that by 2 kids in hockey.

      Reply

      Sammy

      9 years ago

      Made enough to retire early, wife wants to work a few more years and told me I need to do something with my time other than play golf so I work in a big box golf store and have for almost 2 years. I officially hate 80% of the customers. The fact they really suck at golf isn’t their fault but coming in, using our FITTING bays just to hit like we’re an arcade is low class. Acting like they know anything about what irons will give them the tightest dispersion or even realizing how important that is frustrates me to no end, so I’ve given up.

      Customers have no clue about the concept “playing your best” so I sell them whatever and don’t lose one minute of sleep. Never thought of a store where customers could walk out with hundreds of dollars in new equipment and by the end of the golf season not improve their handicap by one index point.

      Reply

      Glenn myers

      8 years ago

      It was 30 years ago that I worked for a company and we developed a Display that let the customer take his or her height and arm lentgh handicap slice or hook etc. The display had several metal wood sets 9.5 10.5 3 & 5 heads only to chose from. Several shafts and grips to choose from. They would fill out the form and take to the sporting goods counter and would recieve thier clubs in two weeks. The company at that time could not re stock invetory to accomadate Walmarts orders at that time. But the Program was very successful. I wonder why the program has not been duplicated since.

      Reply

      petethepro

      9 years ago

      Great article and comments.

      All brand names will fit golf clubs for customers. Many staff members in shops are extremely knowledgeable about every aspect of club design and build. We fit for free, we know EXACTLY what the ball is doing because we have a launch monitor. Companies don’t bundle clubs – a customer can purchase 1 club, fully custom fitted. The quality of the custom fitted clubs from every known brand is amazing. The companies NEVER dictate what clubs we have to stock. We make that choice. We pay for demo clubs and sell them as ex-demo when the model finishes. If you go to 5 clubfitters, you will likely get 5 different sets of specifications because whilst many golfers (tall, short, long fingers, etc.) will require similar specifications, the personal preference of the fitter and the golfer may vary to result. Custom fitting costs the same as clubs sold in the store, with standard specifications. We even sell at discount, because the local, national and international competition dictates we have to. The problem is, having premises to rent, heat/cool, staff to pay, etc. means that making a profit is borderline impossible. We work with insane margins.

      All modern equipment performs to a fantastic level – like a modern car – there are no bad products out there any longer. One or two companies out there dread product reviews, done by golfers, enthusiastic they might well be, because their swings are not capable of repetition. To expect more distance during a ball review is bordering on the ignorant. We each have, probably, a Rules of Golf book. Go to the page about the ball, the 5 limitations governing the performance of. Read carefully. Initial Velocity and Overall Distance Standard. It won’t go any further! The manufacturers of clubs can offer added distance through shaft design, reduced lofts and heads that are more forgiving. Those clubs are for sale in shops the world over.

      Yes, customers are often their own worst enemy. We try to advise them for their own benefit, but so, so many simply know better. You would be amazed how many golfers will more readily take advice from a well-meaning friend or neighbour over the advice from a clubfitter.

      Sadly, many golf shops will have to close due to the downturn in the demand for golf in many countries. There is no changing this situation. There will be casualties and survivors. It’s a re-adjustment so the remaining shops can build their customer base. Make no mistake about this, the competition includes the two till retailers, one till for the business turnover, taxes, etc. and one till that comprises of the trouser pocket. Other competiton is the e-bay retailer – not the once in a while amateur purchase, but the international business sourcing bulk via e-bay and shipping to customers worldwide. No taxes to be paid here. Locate the trading office offshore and you have the complete package. Governments are not tracking these businesses because they are too small to be interesting and too complex to follow the trail.

      Too often a website like this populated by enthusiastic amateurs, which is fine, I guess, the odd expert and the end product is lots of factually incorrect information. I hope I have managed to re-dress the balance a little.

      Reply

      Wayne J Bosley

      9 years ago

      Hi LR,,,, this is exactly the type and range of practical initiatives that will allow
      the game to thrive,,,, they should have been auctioned upon in the 90’s when
      the beginning of the slow down in new and more so younger players was obvious.

      Common sense ideas instead of just making ($’s and) cents,,,,
      Cheers,
      Boz

      Reply

      L Rieke

      9 years ago

      Please promote play independent of the USGA Handicap System, unreserved blocks of tee times for walk-ups, match play, brown roughs with more liberal lateral hazard designations, caddy programs instead of golf cart revenue dependency, consideration for travel paths needed for pull/push carts, walking travel paths, less irrigation and firmer fairways, firmer green approaches, slower greens, and a pick-up and move on mantra until there is open acknowledgment that the plethora of parkland course architecture has frequently created unplayable venues (but often beautiful) that are far removed from the ground game centered links game offered before the disastrous entanglement of course architects with home builders, golf cart rental revenue demands, and the golf equipment industry offering infinite driving distance gains.

      Reply

      Dick Cicero

      9 years ago

      This is where the custom clubmaker has a huge advantage for the golfer over OEMs. Set make up, you only buy the clubs which will best suit your game, with no extra clubs to put in the closet.
      Game improvement and cost effective.

      Reply

      Keith

      9 years ago

      Club manufacturers bundle irons into 8 irons, usually 4,5,6,7,8,9,PW,SW or AW.
      No-one uses a 4 iron anymore, they use a hybrid. Delete the 4 iron, already; we don’t need it or want it. Sell 5 iron through AW, or sell 7 irons in a set, not 8 (I’m sure club manufacturers wont want to sell only 7 clubs, even if it is better for the customer).

      Reply

      Tom Wishon

      9 years ago

      This matter of set makeup brings back an old memory that was actually hilarious to me at the time, though not to the parties involved. I had to sit in on a sales presentation from one of the major OEMS to the other upper level mgmt at Golfsmith in the late 90s. After the floor was open for discussion, one of our retail mgrs asked the OEM if they could just order sets of irons in #4-PW since no one coming into the GS retail stores wanted to buy the 3 iron with the set. The collection of stray 3 irons all through GS’s retail stores was mounting heavily. The OEM sales VP said they couldn’t do that because all sets were manufactured in 3-PW sets. I chimed in from my design and production experience to say that wasn’t so, that all heads of the same number are always made and shipped together so sets were only made when the assembly division of the company grabbed the individual heads from the boxes.

      Well that brought a frown and a pregnant pause in the meeting. Me never liking pregnant pauses in conversations, I chimed in to the effect that their refusal must be because if we ordered sets in 4-Pw, wouldn’t that reduce their revenue per set by 12.5%. another pregnant pause, ended with but the slightest nod to the affirmative from the OEM VP.

      Whereupon I suggested why don’t they sell us sets in 4-AW so they could still keep their 8 pc set revenue and GS’s stores would not have tons of 3 irons to try to sell as fireplace pokers. And that brought agreement all around the table.

      Funny now that the discussion would be to reduce the set purchases to 5-AW since “shrinking loft disease” has now effectively killed the 4 iron at retail. But would they suggest to add on yet another wedge to keep their revenue at 8 pcs?

      Reply

      muscleback

      9 years ago

      “That’s where the game will continue to survive, with the kids.”

      Agree there…that’s why this whole push to capture the “millenials” fancy is a joke…Golf Digest editor (is that Tarde or Diaz?) actually came out in print and stated “the 18-34 demographic is who we are after”…really? Isn’t everyone with a product to sell trying to corral that coveted demo? Just because you are after them doesn’t mean you are going to get them…and in the process you may alienate or even lose your base which is your lifeblood. The kids are definitely the key…guess what?…they don’t read Golf Digest. I laugh when I click on their website and see the trash spewed forth. You can’t put perfume on a pig and right now there is a foul odor emanating from Golf Digest.

      Reply

      Tom Wishon

      9 years ago

      MB, you’re spot on in your comments about GD’s new focus. And especially in your observation about alienating their existing base. The focus has to be on getting more people from ALL segments, definitely kids and milleniums as well, to want to learn to play or want to play more. That means people who are not reading GD presently. The milleniums who do play were fine I bet with GD’s previous look and focus. When you like the game enough to devote time to playing, you don’t need the Paulina’s on the cover or a story about pot use on the golf course in Denver. You need more people playing and no one has a handle on how to really go about doing that right now. Nor does there seem to be much in the way of ongoing valid discussions for just how to really do that. When has there ever been a broad campaign to explain why this is such a great game to get into? Kids need buddies to play with to make it fun enough to keep playing. Milleniums need to be convinced why this is a great game to get into. Spouses need the significant other to be into it. The game has to become less expensive to play. No question it is a significant challenge to do this. There are smart minds out there and big golf entities with money they should be willing to invest to protect the future of the game.

      Reply

      muscleback

      9 years ago

      I cruise GD’s website…the millennial overload is painful…GD is owned by Conde Nast which also owns GQ, Glamour, Vanity Fair and others, so they are targeting the “groovy” crowd. They are trying to show the world that golf is part of the “groovy” crowd. What is funny is they still are dragging grumpy old Dan Jenkins around and propping him up there from time to time so the millenials can make fun of him.

      Thumper 300

      9 years ago

      Manufactures have flooded the market so bad there is no longer any “Awe” you have one of those or a set of those in your bag. In 3 months the next new thing is on the market from all manufacturers. I play with about 20-30 different guys from 2 leagues. At least 5-6 of these guys buy and sell clubs on ebay and give great deals to us. I purchased a brand new Ping G25 driver this summer from one guy for $175.00 and it was selling for over $300.0 in the stores. I had it checked and it is authentic. Another guy sold me a T.Made putter for $65.00 that was selling for $149.95 in the stores. I will never buy from the retailers again unless I need balls and tees in a hurry. Why should I . They have done it to themselves.

      Reply

      jonno

      9 years ago

      it’s amazing, another golf pro blaming the customer for their poor customer service!

      i’ve worked in a golf retailer and i can tell you right now the golf pro’s are the problem, not the customer – i’ve heard golf pros say the same things you hinted at like: i’d never touch a nike golf club they’re all crap and always will be, only titleist make good clubs, this guy has a driver swing speed less than 95mph so he’s a chopper who cares what clubs i sell him.

      don’t blame the customer when it’s your poor customer service that makes them a “bad” customer.

      Reply

      Dick Cicero

      9 years ago

      Paul b visit the International Clubmakers Guild, Association of Golf Club Fitting Professionals, Tom Wishon Golf, and True Temper Performance Fitting Centers. Here you will find Certified Professionals who have attended the best schools and tested on their skills to obtain Certification to fit you properly. Also look for a fitter who uses a Launch monitor out doors on a range for the best fit.

      Reply

      golfercraig

      9 years ago

      Here’s the problem–there are guys on that list that are currently blackballed from shops in their area. If you had work done (reshaft) by them, your club is no longer eligible for trade in. Being on that list doesn’t make it always better. I actually had to call one guy on Tom’s list and ask him if he knew the difference between taper and parallel tip shafts. He was butchering clubs. It’s not rocket science at the fitting level. You don’t need to be “certified.” There are players in your area–the good ones–who have a trusted club guy. Ask them who they use.

      Reply

      Paul b

      9 years ago

      I was fitted by three different golf fitters at different times and for three different brands.
      When I went to buy a new set of clubs, this is what I heard. WHO FITTED YOU?
      They are to long, or to short, or the lie angle is wrong.
      JUST GET ME A CLUBFITTER WHO KNOWS WHAT HE IS DOING AND I WILL NOT ONLY PAY A PREMIUM BUT TELL EVERY SOUL I KNOW TO PAY THIS GUY A VISIT!!!

      Reply

      Dick Cicero

      9 years ago

      One thing about the internet sale a 50% off is the danger of counterfeit clubs. I had a customer bring me a set of Titleist AP2 forged irons which he had purchased on the internet at a $600.00 discount. He wanted the lie adjusted; but when I placed the bending bar on his seven iron, applied a slight bit of pressure the club broke. Consumer beware of fantastic deals.

      Reply

      muscleback

      9 years ago

      “fewer golfers the green fees have
      to rise as the costs are not going to go down”

      Not really…golf courses have been poorly run with over-spending and mis-management for years. They can cut costs just like any business and that doesn’t mean higher green fees. Give me a bare bones operation with a decent layout and a hot dog stand and I’m happy. I don’t need a caviar bar and dozens of employees running around the parking lot doing nothing.

      Reply

      James

      9 years ago

      Where is this golf course with the caviar bar? Sounds cool.

      Reply

      muscleback

      9 years ago

      The Yellowstone Club…Big Sky, Mt.

      “Likewise, the new owners have toned down the décor in the lodge and converted the caviar bar to a breakfast buffet. What was to be a grand ballroom in the basement of the Warren Miller Lodge is now dedicated to children’s activities, with a basketball court, game room and movie theater.”

      muscleback

      9 years ago

      I think anyone who goes in to a golf operation or pro shop that has a launch monitor and/or free fitting situation and gets fitted, lies and pretends to be potential buyer, then leaves and buys online should be tarred and feathered.

      Reply

      Teaj

      9 years ago

      +1

      Reply

      Teaj

      9 years ago

      “You know what else can be a customer service killer? The customers…”

      This made me laugh because I work for a Golf Retailer, thank you for this comment.

      I took a guy through a fitting for his Titleist MB’s he was currently using a set of Mizies with their stock shaft of DG S300. he complained about the weight of the shaft as he is getting a little older he wanted to be fit into a lighter shaft. Oh and he also wanted the same ball flight and feel at no upcharge. I told him this could not be done but I did what I could explain the differences in shafts and affects it could have on his game with regards to the no upcharge offerings from Titleist. Lo and behold not 2 months later did he return after purchasing the lighter shaft he wanted something different even after I explained what would happen. Could I have got him into a lighter shaft that would be a little closer to his current setup, yes but not with being handcuffed with the no-upcharge stipulation given by the customer. If you want the vet and not the chevette you need to pay for it.

      Ok my rant is over

      Regards

      Teaj

      Reply

      James

      9 years ago

      Teaj… obviously the guy was a cheap azz. You should have sent him to K-Mart. Pity his poor waiter when he tips 5%. These guys are annoying. No class.

      Reply

      Teaj

      9 years ago

      What I don’t get is that your spending $1100 on irons, whats $200 more for proper shafts. Oh and because we pride ourselves on customer service we sent the irons back to have upgraded shafts free of cost to the customer. At what point does a company put their foot down and stop being taken advantage of.

      Jonny B

      9 years ago

      From a consumer’s perspective, it appears to me that a lot of the equipment business is going online these days. If anything, someone interested in buying a new driver or set of irons might go to a big box store just to hit it, demo it, see some numbers. Then they take their purchase to the internet because the prices are always going to be lower. There are many reasons for this – internet retailers don’t have to have pretty displays and shelf space of all the new product, they have less employees, and they can hold onto older inventory longer. So the brick and mortar stores are at a disadvantage as they try to compete on price. They can offer better service, custom fitting, etc. to the consumer, but many online retailers are catching up in this area as well by offering “playability guarantees” so the consumer can buy online, even custom fitted equipment direct from the manufacturer, then try the clubs out for 30 days and if they don’t like them, return them for a credit towards their next clubs.

      As far as OEMs go, the only one I see making headways in this area is Callaway with their preowned website. I don’t know exactly where they source their equipment – be it store buybacks, returns, demos, or just excess inventory from the factories (although I don’t think manufacturers have the excess inventory problems that retailers have – they tend to only build what they will sell). Their sales staff are very knowledgeable and most times you can get equipment that is 99% new for a steal, and get it custom fit. I did this recently where I went into a Golf Galaxy and got fitted for irons and a driver, then had the clubs I liked built to spec by Callaway preowned. It was a cost savings of over 50% vs. buying the same exact equipment new in the store. I paid the $50 for the fitting and took my business to the internet.

      I think it’s only a matter of time before we see more of the big names – Dick’s Sports Authority Golfsmith Golf Galaxy, etc. closing up shop or at least closing some of their golf operations. It’s unprofitable and difficult to compete with those who can offer discounted and used equipment. In many ways the big OEMs have brought this on the industry in the search of high profits, by releasing new clubs every 6 months/1 year. 99% of the consumers are going to buy a new $400 driver every year – they are smart to this now and willing to wait until the new driver is $200 6 months later.

      Reply

      proside

      9 years ago

      Know of a BB staffer who admitted to the police of stealing around 500 full sets of clubs from his store. Never got charged. This was within the last year.
      Don’t know why but I suspect that someone hopes to keep their job by not reporting how poorly inventory is monitored. Can’t imagine another plausible reason.

      Reply

      Thomas

      9 years ago

      The game is losing players mostly due to it is no longer a sport that a family can partake in together, overall high cost (equipment & green fees) and time ( 4 to 5 hours). The 1st. Tee attempts to generate interest at an early age, however its still much cheaper and cooler to the young ones to start in many of the team sports (baseball, football, soccer etc.) or go fishing.

      Reply

      bsoudi

      9 years ago

      Thomas, don’t fall into the baloney line that’s around here so much that high equipment costs are a holding the game back. It seems to be all this site and its readers are about. It’s based on the ridiculous assumption that you can’t enjoy the game – even if you’re a beginner or casual golfer – unless you have the latest and most advanced clubs.

      Go to Golfsmith.com and there are ELEVEN choices for FULL SETS of clubs for under $500. There are 3 options under $250. And they INCLUDE BAGS!

      Reply

      Thomas

      9 years ago

      Your right bsoundi, I just checked out Golfsmith in Cleveland.
      Hell I live 1/4 of a mile from the only FREE and very well maintained public 9 hole golf course (Buhl Farm, Hermitage. PA) in the USA. I notice only a few youngsters playing.

      Dvzee1

      9 years ago

      As a retired person new to golf,when that when I look at a 400 dollar driver and see the head made in China, the shaft from Vietnam and assembled in Mexico I really wonder what’s going . The $300 putter makes no sense to me at all. I also think the golf club companies have lost control of their products by farming out the production so adjustments are difficult or impossible.

      Reply

      muscleback

      9 years ago

      “But something does have to be done or in 20 yrs this game and its industry will be a lot smaller.”

      so what?

      Reply

      Wayne Bosley

      9 years ago

      Hi Tom, thanks for the feedback,,,,

      Hi MB, I think the idea of a smaller game is what Tom might be looking at
      which means fewer jobs , fewer courses , fewer choices than we have now.

      The big area of concern for me with a reduction in the size of the golf
      industry will be the potential loss of many municipal courses for the less
      well off golfer or more social type player as we are now seeing in Australia.

      Council / municipal owned courses are being sold off for their prime land
      values and great positioning due to the cost incurred in maintenance
      against a back drop of local residents now looking for alternate sports
      facilities and the like as the golfing population drops,,,,

      Reply

      muscleback

      9 years ago

      I know about Mr. Wishon and respect his work. Other than my favorite local Muni going defunct which I would hate, almost every other aspect of the game of golf growing smaller appeals to me. Cheaper green fees, less crowded golf courses, fewer golf carts, more walking…the way the game should be. I maintain growing the game has hurt the game. Most of the preaching we hear constantly pleading for “growing the game” is coming from those who stand to lose $$$ from the shrinkage. When they shout “grow the game” they really mean “grow our wallets”.

      Wayne Bosley

      9 years ago

      Yes I understand your thoughts but with fewer golfers the green fees have
      to rise as the costs are not going to go down, fewer golfers will mean a
      more expensive game especially at the municipal level as they wont
      absorb the added costs against a reduced income level from the fewer
      players.

      Moderation and balance in player numbers are ok but a real shrinkage
      will come with some pain unfortunately and as I mentioned we will end
      up a with fewer playing choices,,, some courses will just have to close
      especially if there a a lot fewer players,,,, this wont be the case for the
      well off clubs as they just increase the membership fees,,,,

      That is why I still fail to see why the large golf equipment companies
      have so much power in our game when in fact the courses have
      always held the upper hand in regards to the market size and more
      directly to player numbers and as such the overall size of the industry.

      The issue is they are a very fragmented group and in many cases are
      run by amateur volunteer committee’s (even the most private of clubs)
      or by local council bureaucrats that don’t have a real understanding of
      the game,,,, so in fact the potential group power is well and truly diluted.

      Regis

      9 years ago

      Well said. Although we love the equipment aspect of the forums, the reality is that what the OEMs do or do not do has very little impact on the growth or the future of the game. They’ll just respond to it.

      MattF

      9 years ago

      ” with fewer golfers the green fees have
      to rise as the costs are not going to go down, fewer golfers will mean a
      more expensive game especially at the municipal level as they wont
      absorb the added costs against a reduced income level from the fewer
      players.”

      Wholeheartedly agree. We, as golfers, need to try and get our kids involved, not push them into it, but introduce them to the game, putting in the lounge room and pitching in the front or back yard.

      My son loves hitting balls around the yard and I take him to a local pitch and putt , which I should be doing more often than I currently do.

      That’s where the game will continue to survive, with the kids.

      bsoudi

      9 years ago

      My big fear, too, is that courses will go away and there’ll eb fewer places for this public golfer to play.

      Courses have the most to lose, yet they seem to be doing the least to maintain/grow interest in the game. Everyone on here may hate equipment manufacturers, but at least their advertising efforts somewhat market the game, often in an appealing way. Courses, their owners and their staff/pros do almost NOTHING to market and maintain/grow the game.

      + Have helpful rangers keep the pace
      + Have a decent email mailing list – remind people what you offer. Good photos. Events.
      + Do local advertising
      + Partner with the local park district for leagues, lessons and clinics
      + Let me book tee times easily online (via GolfNow, not your proprietary system. I don’t want 20 logins or to visit 20 sites to find a time)
      + Let me find out when there are available times – without making a phone call
      + Let me play 6 or 9 or 12 or 18 holes
      + Save $$$ by eliminating the 7000+ yard tee boxes (what’s their ROI?)
      + Save $$$ by going more brown, less rough
      + Go ahead and have 15-inch cups or PGA kid team golf. It doesn’t hurt regular golfers…if it makes a few more people show up, great. Incremental business.
      + Partner with other courses – locally, regionally or nationally – to market the game. Use celebrities like someone suggested.

      While true – courses are a very fragmented group – one thread that is mostly common is PGA pros. They should be training all their people in THIS, rather than how to hit the ball better and give lessons. They should be doing marketing projects and golfer outreach, not checking their phones all day. It will ultimately save their jobs.

      Tony Covey

      9 years ago

      We talk about this quite a bit. As golf declines, greens fees and costs associated with actually playing the game (never mind the equipment) must go up. There’s no 1 to 1 ratio here, as the number of rounds decrease, the cost to maintain the course doesn’t decrease at the same rate. Whether you have 10 golfers on your course or 100, your upkeep cost is basically the same. The lawn still needs to be mowed. All of the lights have to stay on, etc…

      Equipment is the ultimate nightmare scenario. Publicly traded companies must not only maintain profits, the expectation is they’ll make more this year than last. How do you do that when you have fewer golfers? You have to make more money off the golfers you have. When volume is lower, margins must be higher. What’s worthy of a footnote is that while 2014 wasn’t a great year for golf in general, the actual number of units sold (individual clubs if you will) was down on slightly. The issue from the business end is that the actual selling price of those units was down significantly. Same volume…less revenue. Nobody survives if that continues.

      golfercraig

      9 years ago

      You and I have talked about this often. Units sold is fool’s gold. Even holding the same margin % is fool’s gold. It’s margin $ that matters. No bank takes a check with a % sign on it. The OEM’s need to do a few things, but they won’t. First–kill all grey market dealers. They needlessly lower the value of the clubs. No chance that happens. It’s a way to cook the books. Honestly, once sales tax starts getting collected on all internet sales–ebay included–the gap in price will be low enough that the local shop will be able to compete again.

      Wayne Bosley

      9 years ago

      Always good to hear from people like Tom on the industry,, that has changed over the
      years to one that is run / controlled by the Large Corporate Sports OEM’s ,,,be it retail
      / tour / am associations through profit opportunities or sponsorship.

      The game is not broken but the amount of money it can generate has levelled,,,this
      is why Fortune Brands sold sold off Cobra to Puma then Titleist / FJ and Pinnacle to
      Fila Korea.

      Large publicly listed companies need growth for their shareholders and will do most
      anything to achieve this,,,,just look at the long term carnage from the 2008 GFC,,,
      they don’t really care about anyone or anything except the mighty dollar.

      The internet is speeding up the problems in so many markets today and with its power
      and reach I see many jobs are continuing to go,,,, quality jobs are being lost and we
      are not finding new ones fast enough.

      That I feel is one of the biggest problems the industry faces today.

      I have had more than 30 years in the industry mainly working with Acushnet but in
      order to try and have a longer term future in the business I have spent the last 10 years
      building my own brand when in fact the industry doesn’t need any new sellers EXCEPT
      that real innovation does usually come from the start ups of the world so I continue to
      battle on with family capital and an international group of players that have given me
      a true belief in my designs,,,,

      Golf has always been run by too many older guys who do not want to be a part of a reshape and have actively blocked any real moves to help younger, poorer people learn the game so
      that they might come and play more when they are older and have more time.

      It is not about Elite players / Tour golf / Tiger type players saving our industry it is about
      recreational activity golf that is more cost effective that will improve our communities and
      general health especially if you walk the course be it 6 / 9 or 18 holes.

      How many other sports can you name where a grand parent can play a sport alongside
      their grand kids and potentially great grand kids,,,,maybe only 9 holes and a couple of
      hours and a whole new way to interact and communicate ,,,, when did the golf industry
      ever put a real value on this great experience opportunity and try and promote it??

      Just a few thoughts but real change is not really going to be about the 15″ cups and Hack
      golf ideas,,,,they are valid ideas but I believe there are much better ways forward without
      loosing the real structure of the game we love.

      Reply

      Tom Wishon

      9 years ago

      Boy how right you are in many of your comments and observations. Golf companies have no business being a part of Wall St because the market is much too small – less than 8% of the total population even plays the game more than 1 time a year and only 3% of the total US population accounts for over 75% of the total revenue in the game. You can’t have publicly traded companies acting responsibly in the best interests of the consumers with a market picture like that ! Look at every other industry which has publicly traded companies and you see that their market is at least 50% or more of the total population.

      You’re dead right about the Hack Golf approach too. Friends of mine in the business side of the golf media tell me that the biggest problem for this game down the road is the fact that the millenium generation doesn’t like golf, doesn’t think it cool enough, don’t want to have anything to do with it. That’s hurting things now but down the road 20 yrs it will be terrible for the game unless the 20, 30-somethings of today figure out what a great game this is.

      2 Months ago I approached Jerry Tarde to suggest that he and his publication spearhead a marketing program with the support of the entities with real money – USGA, PGA Tour, PGA of America – to get celebrities who do play the game who appeal to the milleniums to get on TV and in print to talk about why they love the game and why they play. To bring out these things like you mention about grandpas playing with sons and grandsons and how much this is a game for life and all that we here know to be the reasons we love this game.

      Doubt they’ll do something like that because who out there has the clout and respect to get the USGA, PGA Tour and PGA of America to cough up $5 to 10 mill a year to tell the non players how great this game is? But something does have to be done or in 20 yrs this game and its industry will be a lot smaller.

      Reply

      Tony Covey

      9 years ago

      Amen, Tom. Your suggestion to Mr. Tarde is why, assuming anybody on the product side of the industry gets their crap together, adidas and more-so Nike are arguably the only ones positioned for long term survival. As has been pointed out, the millennials have little interest in golf (I can count the junior members at my club on one hand). They grew up with the NFL and LeBron. It’s Johnny Football, not Tiger Woods. The star power from outside of golf…nearly all of it resides with those two brands.

      So many of those stars, however, are golfers. Rock stars and miscellaneous celebrities. Golf isn’t cool…athletes and rock stars are cool, and they have the potential to make golf cool. All this stuff about hacking golf, and making it cool from the inside out won’t work. Reality is guys like Jimmy Fallon, Adam Levine, and countless other guys who don’t fit the stodgy image of what a golfer looks like are the sport’s best (if not only) hope.

      Funny…Callaway actually tried to harness the power of celebrity several years ago when they brought Justin Timerberlake in as Creative Director. Not a bad idea, but I think they just missed their demo. Turns out 12 year old girls don’t buy a lot of golf clubs.

      muscleback

      9 years ago

      “So many of those stars, however, are golfers. Rock stars and miscellaneous celebrities. Golf isn’t cool…athletes and rock stars are cool, and they have the potential to make golf cool. All this stuff about hacking golf, and making it cool ”

      And this is exactly why Golf Digest has gone ” all millennial, all the time” with the mag and their website…it’s all about cleavage, celebrity and soft porn…Paulina Gretzky is gonna grow the game?…get you page clicks and views maybe, but little else. It’s a huge jump from the bikini shot to the first tee. Even Arnie humping Kate Upton ain’t gonna get it done. You guys are dreaming on this one.

      Tony Covey

      9 years ago

      Big picture, you might be right, but I hope you’re wrong.

      I do think you’re spot on with your point about what GD is apparently attempting. Of course, it would be interesting to see what the real motivation is. Is the new approach a legitimate attempt at growing the game, or is it desperation from a business trying to push paper in the digital world to a declining audience?

      Is the T&A to grow golf or sell magazines?

      Across the board the celebrity/star power approach has been poorly executed. You can’t use traditional golf outlets to reach non-golfers.

      You know who doesn’t read golf magazines? Non-golfers.

      I don’t think sticking a celeb on a golf magazine cover and hoping the masses will come makes any sense whatsoever. You need the stars to bring golf to the non-golf markets. You need Johnny Manziel (suspect example considering how the season played out) to bring golf to football fans. You need Jimmy Fallon to bring golf to his fans. Expecting NFL fans and whatnot will suddenly become interested in golf because is on the cover of a golf magazine is foolishness.

      It’s obviously a smaller scale example, but Powerbilt has MMA fighters essentially on its golf staff. And those guys…they’re introducing golf to an audience about as far removed from the game’s traditions as you can probably imagine, but they’ve been successful with it (again, on a relative scale). Again…they bring golf to their fans, they don’t expect their fans to come to golf because they did a photo shoot for some magazine said fans have never heard of.

      I’m not certain it can making a lasting impact, but it’s closer to what needs to be done than cover models in bikinis.

      Tom Wishon

      9 years ago

      Tony, you’re dead on when you say that GD’s new “millenium approach” does no good when the milleniums who do not play never see the magazine. When Tarde responded to my email suggestion about the celebrity marketing campaign, he was quick to point out their move into more of a milleniums’ appeal. By by the general tone of his response, I could tell that my suggestion was falling on deaf ears so I didn’t respond back with your comment about it being the NON golfer milleniums who never read GD that we need to attract.

      The other thing that is sad is that I do perceive with all the people who for whatever reasons choose to strongly dislike Obama, it very well could be that when the media shows him playing golf, it could have a negative effect on promoting more to take up the game. Shoot, used to be when a president openly played golf, the game enjoyed real growth in participation. Not so now I guess.

      But as much as entities in the game moan about the drop in participation, it sure seems that a well planned marketing campaign funded by those with the money who would benefit the most from more participation should be at least considered. Now how’s that ever going to happen?

      Tony Covey

      9 years ago

      It’s also worth a mention (I think) that the various self-described grow golf efforts are anything but cohesive, with the only thing actually binding many of them together is the pursuit of money. Growth in and of itself should improve the financial realities of those involved in the game, but with the current level of segmentation, nothing much will get accomplished. Everybody has his own angle…almost nobody is in it for the game itself.

      HackGolf – simplify the game, make it more fun, and ultimately introduce a new presumably non-conforming revenue stream for the game’s biggest manufacturer.
      FootGolf – Brings more people to the golf course…not to play golf. Great option for courses with no other options, I suppose, but does nothing to grow the game of golf.
      TopGolf – Sounds like a blast, and guys are hitting golf balls with golf clubs, but won’t do much to stimulate the equipment industry, and there’s no evidence that suggests guys who enjoy target shooting over a few beers and a basket of wings will ever make their way to the golf course in any meaningful numbers.

      For this whole grow thing to work, there’s going to need to be more cooperation, and that seldom happens with its every man for himself on a sinking ship.

      Regis

      9 years ago

      With all due deference I think we may be stretching this too far. Shortly after I started playing the Hope and the Crosby were hot tournaments in part because of the then “hot” celebrities that played in the pro-am. Did it help grow the game-maybe. Now neither tournament can draw flies at least in terms of top players. I have two daughters ages 22 and 27. They and their friends could care less about golf and I doubt any of them even know that our president plays. Current events are also not on their radar. Now if the Kardashians or Lady Gaga became golf fanatics might it move the cool needle? The millenials will take up golf if their friends take it up. That is what will make it cool. Celebrity participation or presidential participation has minimal impact. On the contrary if golf becomes cool the celebrities will flock to it.

      PlaidJacket

      9 years ago

      I stop by a small golf retailer close to me from time to time. Mostly to look around and kill some time on my lunch hour or for an impulse buy. Bought a pair of new shoes before Christmas. I’m not in the market for any clubs. I bought custom this past summer. I will be either buying a new driver, fw. or hybrid or perhaps just new shafts this spring. I’ll work with my fitter. Too be honest, I’ll probably never buy another retail store club again. I never was a guy that had to have the latest and greatest. I don’t think there are any major breakthroughs left in golf. The clubs are long, the balls are long, my pants are long.

      Reply

      james

      9 years ago

      Good thing your pants are long. Always goes better with a plaid jacket.

      Reply

      Tom Wishon

      9 years ago

      A friend turned me on to this article and with my experience of having been a VP at Golfsmith for 9 yrs (though my duties were not involved in the retail division) and working with them during their entry into big box retailing, I found this article both hilarious and sad. Hilarious because I saw everything the author reported in the article and then some. Sad because what I saw is obviously still going on and it’s not a good situation for the consumers. Or for the retailers or OEMS too, when you really think about it.

      What will make it better? Fewer retailers selling the same exact products so service, attention, training, and margins can be better. Higher wages and incentive based training for the retail sales staff to keep the good ones who care. Better management training to instill respect and care for the staff. REAL custom fitting that involves far more than 20 mins hitting a handful of clubs on an oft suspect launch monitor/simulator under the eyes of a person who doesn’t know squat about fitting.

      But that won’t happen because it would require the OEMS to accept much lower annual sales and accept less profit margin so the retailers could make more to support the changes. So it’s likely nothing is going to change.

      I remember really making the owners of GS mad back in my days there when after they kept rejecting my suggestions for improvement, I suggested they just get rid of the staff and put in big credit card vending machines for selling the clubs. Watching the callous condescending attitude of some of the OEMS to the company (not all, mind you), from the company’s upper management to middle management, from middle management to the floor staff, and from the floor staff to the consumers, with nothing being done to make it better was just one of several reasons I finally got fed up and quit to go do my own thing.

      Reply

      Robert Dwyer

      9 years ago

      Golf is fading with the economy. What OEM’s have done is flooded the market to the extent that the only to deal with excess inventory is to push it out on Ebay. This alone is costing retailers millions.
      For the last five or so years the solution has been obvious, but profit trumps all, Lower the margins, sell at affordable prices and increase resale values. This also applies to the golf industry in total. If you want to bring people back to the game and incite new golfers, make it affordable. As for the fraud and theft well that’s part of retail It appears that the justice system treats this as a cost of doing business as those who are caught don’t face any real consequences of their action. Unfortunately retailers are at a greater risk confronting thief’s then just letting them go!

      Reply

      Jeff

      9 years ago

      Very interesting article.
      Love to hear a response from the OEM.Bet we won’t

      Reply

      SandyR.Karse

      9 years ago

      Keep up the good work, best regards.

      Reply

      Dick Cicero

      9 years ago

      With all the problems buying off the rack clubs that don’t fit, why don’t more golfers take advantage of the small Professional Clubmaker/Fitter for the right equipment? They can receive a quality fitting with a launch monitor on an outdoor range where they can get instant feedback and be fitted with the right loft and lie angles, face angle, club length, swingweight (MOI), shaft flex, shaft bend point, shaft torque, and grip size. The golfer will not only benefit financially, but their game will improve and scores will go down.

      Reply

      Tom Wishon

      9 years ago

      The reason more don’t search out a GOOD clubfitter is because the hundreds of millions spent in image/brand marketing by the OEMS makes it too difficult for the avg consumer to believe that what he can get in an independent clubmaker’s shop can be as good as what’s sold off the rack by $10/hr sales people in big box stores or on line. It takes a LOT of research into independent custom clubfitting before most consumers take that leap of faith to go find and work with a good clubfitter. But those who do find a GOOD clubfitter know as you say that it is far better than the existing business model of the big companies and big retailers.

      Reply

      Regis

      9 years ago

      In terms of dedication and knowledge of the game, the posters here represent the elite. On the other side of the spectrum are the golfers who play 5-10 times a year and probably couldn’t tell you what ball they played last round. Somewhere in the middle lies the “average golfer”. As much as the elite preach club fitting and the benefits of same, the average golfer has no interest and even the elite who post here wouldn’t reach a consensus as to how much a true custom fitting would benefit the average golfer.. Most of my 50 years of playing was at a private club and even for these more serious players, they will demo a club, maybe talk to the club pro but that’s as far as they’re willing to go. OEM’s manufacture and market clubs with some stock options and shaft options to the average golfer because that’s where their market is. So pointing fingers at OEMs doesn’t fly.

      Revkev

      9 years ago

      While I’ve never had a fitter build a set for me I most certainly have had a fitter take my existing set and fit it and also had my current set ordered for to to spec. It makes a difference. Personally I would far prefer to pay a bit more money and get fit for a set that will last me 3-5 years rather than be flipping sets every year or sometimes less.

      I also think this would be better for people’s games. The questions is, how do we get to that model?

      It’s ofetn hard to find a good fitter and they struggle to stay in business.

      Jeff

      9 years ago

      Well I never ever had a golf set from a fitter.
      My first full set was a Ping Anser black dot LH and my first score was 78.These I brought from our club pro.Had this set for nearly 35 yrs and got down to a1 hcp.
      About 4yrs ago I purchased a set of LH Miura with the Nippon 950 light shaft standard lie and still have these as they are superb.
      I cannot see any great advantage overall in getting fitted for any club.
      I recently purchased of the shelf a Ping G25 driver with no trialling and hit it superbly.
      Lucky maybe but I don’t think so.

      Blitz

      9 years ago

      You obviously don’t live in Canada…

      Reply

      muscleback

      9 years ago

      Excellent…keep up the fight MyGolfSpy.

      Reply

      Rod_CCCGOLFUSA

      9 years ago

      I worked at a big box store prior to opening my own club making/repair shop. Chain sales outlets are commodity retailers who depend on traffic, not relationships, to develop sales and profits. Those in the C-suites see golf sales not as unique, but as merchandise to be moved in the same way as K-mart, Sears, or other big retailers. In fact, Golfsmith has had grocery store retailers on its board of directors. One should not discount the effect on OEM’s of pressure from retailers to clear the shelves and stock the latest fad. OEM’s are delivering not with measureably improved products, but with ever more dramatic advertizing claims. R&D departments can not keep up with the marketing pressures so we get new paint jobs on products with barely different performance stats.

      Reply

      Andy

      9 years ago

      Just a matter of time before the OEM deals directly with the public and retail golf stores go away. The retail stores serve little to no value to me. Like it or not, I get the best information from fellow golfers and sites like MyGolfSpy. If I feel the product needs to be tested, I can show up at a demo day at the course and then buy the product online (mostly Used on eBay).

      Reply

      golfer4life

      9 years ago

      They are already doing that. You can go online and buy directly from a few of the larger OEM’s. They push fitting and customer relations, then the next thing you know they are selling directly to the public. From a couple off record discussions, I believe you will see some major law suites coming in the very near future. I personally don’t know specifics about the legal obligations from OEM’s to retailers, but apparently this is something that was created not to let them be pushed out.
      I can personally speak for the lack of employee benefits from a big box store. When I say benefits, I’m not talking vacation and health care but, more employee appreciation such as discounts and incentive programs. 25% on soft lines and 10% hard lines is embarrassing to offer your employees. Customer receive better discounts than the people you put your trust in to make your company work? There were always outside companies and programs offering discounts to employees working for big box stores, now the company I am speaking of is shutting those down trying to force employees to buy from them. It doesn’t seem to hard to understand that if you gave your employees a better deal they wouldn’t look anywhere else to start with. It would also create a more positive relationship that would benefit sales with less turnover and better quality employees.
      And corp being out of touch with what is really going on in the trenches couldn’t be any more true. They don’t have the slightest clue to what really happens or what needs to happen. So much money being wasted and being left behind because of the mind set that corporate big wheels have all the answers its a wonder some aren’t out of business already.
      Good article with some interesting opinions!

      Reply

      Will Par

      9 years ago

      Customer Service, inventory control, sales goals, returns, customer and employee theft, unwanted product that doesn’t sell, corporate policy… these are not just big box golf retail issues… these are issues that must be managed in almost every retail business. There is nothing surprising here for anyone who has ever been a manager or worked in any type of retail business.

      Reply

      hckymeyer

      9 years ago

      Interesting article, but like most have said it’s an article about working in a retail store. It just happens to use golf language.

      What I’d really be interested in is an article from the HQ buyers perspective. That’s where the OEM’s will have influence and where all the negotiating will happen.

      Reply

      David Bevil

      9 years ago

      Has anyone ever read a golf club or golf ball review that said “these are awful, don’t buy them”? A really good place to start with all this corrective action might be with telling the actual truth about equipment by magazines, internet sites, and so on. A good example might be “Gosh these new irons are great but your 2012’s are just as good.”.

      Reply

      Jonas

      9 years ago

      If you write a review about golf equipment and say, “These are awful,” or even, “Don’t buy these because the model from 2 years ago is just as good,” you’ll quickly find that you don’t have a lot of other equipment from that company to review. Plus, other companies see that you can be tough and they’ll be reluctant to give you stuff to review, as well.

      The golf industry doesn’t have a Consumer Reports type of reviewing entity, where they buy all their own stuff and don’t accept advertisements. Everyone depends on the stuff from the OEMs to review and can’t say anything really bad about the product because advertising could go away.

      Plus, equipment is very subjective. I can be a mid-handicapper and review a product, but I can only give my own take on it. I can’t definitively say how well it will work for a pro or a hacker. Maybe it’s well suited for my right-to-left swing and my warm-climate country club where I test, etc., so it gets a better review than it would warrant for you who has a fade and plays in colder weather on public courses. So it’s not the same as, say, a washing machine, where I can objectively test it and say, yes, this one gets the clothes cleaner.

      Reply

      golfercraig

      9 years ago

      I used to be a tester for golfwrx (before I got banned for calling an industry “insider” for a blatant and provable lie.) I wrote a review of golf ball saying exactly that. It was an OK ball, seemed to spin fine when I hit it clean, didn’t notice any distance gain or loss, and it seemed to hold to scuffing very well. It was deleted, and I was told by the OEM that unless I made a better review, I wouldn’t be a tester anymore. I told them to jump in a lake. My favorite part of reviews are the reviews by the 15 handicap telling me a ball is 4 yards longer off their 8 iron. Kiss my ass. A 15 doesn’t hit the sweet spot 3 times in 4 rounds. Also, keep in mind, a lot of the reviewers are actually horrible. One of the respected, and highly listened to, members of WRX shot 121 in a round I played with him. I beat him by 50. FIFTY. And by his swing, I think that may have been one of his better scores. But he’s a “13” handicap. Skip the reviews.

      Reply

      Nor

      9 years ago

      No wonder everything and anything from big OEMs reviewed on WRX always get high score.
      Be it Ping, Titleist, Taylormade, Callaway or what have you; while smaller brands got lower score (ie. TourEdge).

      Not that i agreed 100% with MGS testing process, but at least they always provide the data!

      Blitz

      9 years ago

      LMFAO!!!

      Marc

      9 years ago

      That is awesome. Harsh but true, many people aren’t as good as they think.

      joe vanderbeke

      9 years ago

      Just started getting back into reading mygolfspy because you can drown in all the bullshit that flows through the site.

      There is a guy at my club and a guy at my old club who test for golfwrx and another popular site – (not this one)

      amazing how whatever club they test is God’s gift to golf community and yet my old mizuno blades or 2 year old Cobra driver out performs the clubs they are saying adds 30 yds to anyones drives.

      Deeply appreciate the brutal honest truth – well played telling whoever you did to go jump in a lake – product reviews need more honesty.

      Dave K

      9 years ago

      Speaking of being banned from golfwrx, I was recently for posting a couple of images of airborne, back spinning ball flights of Pings TR, compared to mine. Not my original posting, but someone asked the question of TR. I had the correct answer. My .com water marks on my images were also an issue since I am not a paying member or sponsor. Gorilla marketing , mentioning golf equipment non sponsored, they insist is spam, promoting, bla, bla bla. Its happened at a few other corrupt, moderator, selective manipulative social golf sites as well. Puttertalk, near death experience at the Sandtrap. Who owns these sites? Their identity is hidden and when I asked who I was communicating with, it fell on death ears. Could they be owned by OEM’S?, who don’t not believe in freedom of speech? I’m a member at Golfspy, but pretty much only look and keep my thoughts to my self. It becomes way to aggravating to be brutally honest, and brutally beaten down! Cheers!

      Nick

      9 years ago

      Whilst I see that working in golf may not be a bed of roses, the issues discussed are generic to all retail, with the exception of the relationships with the golf OEM’s and the way inventory is (mis)managed. I worked for a sports retail company that went from nothing to enormous in not many years and from the word go the IT and inventory systems were cutting edge (Big data). It’s one of the main reasons they were so successful. Stocktaking is a religion and bonuses given to those whose stock most resembles the expected levels, engaging employees. Thievery is a societal problem and occurs in all spheres where there might be money to be made…and some of my former colleagues had a robust reaction to catching shoplifters.

      One thing that was unique in the article was the outlook store employees have on customers. I don’t shop at Big Box stores in the UK because the shop staff, mostly, have a vaguely disinterested aura that says they have a better swing that you’ll ever have and that even if you buy that £300 driver, it won’t help you be as good as them. It pushed me towards a small, pro fitter and I thank them for that.

      Reply

      Tad Myers

      9 years ago

      This artical is so true. I work at a dick’s sporting goods in there golf department and its no so much the theft that I see but the product that they send me. For example, I need more womens half finger gloves. They dont send me them. Instead they send me more footjoy mens gloves that never sell. I still have a full box of gloves in my stock room they I got in the spring. Its also true about theft. Its really funny about the titilist golf balls. We are required to put anty theft stickers on the boxes but people dont steel the boxes they steel the balls inside. The former pro that I worked under said he saw 2 old women steel 5 dozen balls.
      I like woking their because it gives me experence in working in the golf industry but I can see the writing on the wall that they might kill the dicks sporting goods golf department soon.

      Reply

      ForeRight

      9 years ago

      Hey Tad, I can see by your reply that you’re a pretty sharp guy. Did you ever take an English Grammar class? How about spelling? You might look into spell check or grammar check before you type up your resume. Just sayin’.

      Reply

      peter

      9 years ago

      Did the industry ever consider “Fair pricing”, as overpriced items creates increased perceived value lack, reduced attainability and become more attractive to theft and black market activity. Lower prices increases sales , reduces theft while maintaining similar profits.

      Reply

      RAT

      9 years ago

      Very interesting but I believe most people my already figured most of this out.
      I come from a business that was very tight on their product and learned this through many years of cost and loss prevention” Warren Buffet” company. Still there is small loop holes
      Nothing is perfect. There is merit that treat your team as a team and not over compensate just top sales but spread the wealth around does wonders . What does Henry say the acceptable loss margin “write offs” are from most companies.?

      Reply

      golfercraig

      9 years ago

      Couple of things here….

      1.No. The companies don’t tell you what to bring in. Ever. That is your buyer’s job. This isn’t up for debate. I never ONCE had a company tell me I had to bring in a particular product. The guy on the floor has no idea what is going on in the buyer’s meetings. If you have the wrong product, it’s the buyers fault. Period.

      2.Spiffing isn’t “prohibited.” It’s done–it’s just that the company keeps the money. It’s a margin enhancer. There is no other realm of retail that is expected to survive on a $400 product costing $290. So, you take the $20/driver sale that Callaway/Adams/TM pay and keep it. It’s expensive to have a business open.

      3.”Typically, the OEMs send the demos well after the stock has hit the shelves.” Once again–that’s the buyer’s fault, not the OEM. I never once, in 15 years as a buyer, had the demo’s show up late. Not once. Get your order in, get your demo’s ordered–you get your product. It’s not hard.

      All of these problems are inherent in every business. Go check out a camera forum, or a computer forum. It’s the same everywhere. This isn’t a golf specific problem. “Henry” admits he’s not sure what exactly goes on in HQ. That’s pretty clear.

      Reply

      Regis

      9 years ago

      I have learned so much from the retail guys posting on this site. So Henry’s tale doesn’t really add much. In essence, Henry could have been an 8 year sales associate at Macy’s on 34th Street in Manhattan and his observations would be the same. Retailers build in a certain margin for inventory loss (be it shoplifting or employee theft) Once it starts pushing the needle they take steps to bring it back under control.

      Reply

      Garry

      9 years ago

      The OEM’s do tell what we have to order. When my rep comes in and tells me I have to order 11 things out of 12 catagories. and 10% of a $250,000 order has to be Bags-towels.

      The OEM’s expect the seller to give his time and money. They say service your customer. GIVE AWAY your time – give away a fitting. BUT don’t give away a dozen balls.. that gets you a suspension. Only MY TIME AND MONEY can be used at my expense.

      It is the big box cry babies that is one big problem in golf. They want fixed pricing and set margins. The worst thing to happen to golf lately is the “Great American Junk Store” is the new “Home Depot” golf big box brought to you buy Arthur “Home Depot” Blank’s PGA Warehouse

      You go into a big eye sore warehouse. Can’t find a sells person. Lousy stock. Nobody knows squat about.. The good Mom and Pop types have been run out by corporate greed.

      I

      Reply

      golfercraig

      9 years ago

      You need to do a better job negotiating with your rep. He has grey market accounts that will take whatever you don’t want that you order to get the best discount. They do have the ability to negotiate with you. You DO NOT have to take what they tell you. Trust me.

      labillyboy

      9 years ago

      Bingo…

      As someone with over 15 years in retail sporting goods, several years at a major golf manufacturer a couple business degrees and years of executive management experience; this article’s only value is the discussion it might evoke. The writer’s limited perspective is evident and lacks any true knowledge of how a large retail business is run, much less any insight into what goes on at a major golf OEM. His anecdotal accounts though true, really are meaningless in evaluating the subject he’s trying to explore.

      I always get a kick out of the altruistic expectations people have of golf manufacturers. Let me put it this way, ALL of them are out for one thing and one thing only… to run a profitable business. They know a lot more than the collective commentary here at MGS about how that happens. They also don’t operate in a vacuum, they compete with each other tooth and nail for every consumer $, calls for them to lengthen release schedules, pay retail clerks more money, require every golf club to be custom fit, ignore the power of big box retail in favor of green grass shops, cease making dubious performance claims for this year’s model… call it Golf Socialism. Like it’s political counterpart, it doesn’t work in the real world of capitalism; the first major OEM to follow the desires of the collective here will be the first to file bankruptcy. Like they say, you don’t bring a knife to a gun fight.

      Reply

      John

      9 years ago

      I think that the major brands need to rethink their pricing strategies. $400.00 for a new driver is too much….

      Reply

      James

      9 years ago

      It’s subjective. I think most serious golfers would pay $700 for a driver that absolutely delivers 20 more yards, with straighter shots. Replacing hype with actual performance.

      Reply

      solar

      9 years ago

      If OEM brands lower their prices, no one will buy their drivers. Consumers are mislead to believe the higher the cost the better the equipment.
      Remember this game is about feel. If it feels good it will give you confidence.

      You think golf equipment is expensive!
      Every time my kid breaks a hockey stick, I say out loud “there goes another driver or putter”.
      BWT times that by 2 kids in hockey.

      Reply

      Garry

      9 years ago

      1.Tell what OEM in the business world doesn’t call the shots? Tell me something new! If you were a OEM would you let the residents in the insane asylum call the shots? Tell what CEO doesn’t think he is the smartest guy in the room(that goes for all industries)

      2. I had my demos before I got my 1st order or they were with them as the new stuff came out. The OEMs charge us for those DEMO’S. Cost is a little lower than our normal wholesale cost. Limited qty. Mostly depends on your level.

      3. Sending back stuff is limited. Taylor has a $1000 no questions ask send back. Over that it has to OK’ed by the serving rep. Callaway being the worst and Ping being just about as bad.

      4. Shopping lifting. Age old problem. When I caught some jack ass stealing. We prosecuted to the fullest extent and put up on our specials board of who we busted and a picture of them. Total humiliation

      5. Credit card fraud by employees or customers is nothing new. Goes in the same category as THEFT.. a cost of doing business.. very costly one at that. BUT this isn’t just a golf issue. None of the things listed are a golf issue. It is a issue in every business.

      6. Margins are set by the OEMS. Driver that sells for $399. Highest level discount would be about $240.. $150 price margin built right into the fixed price of $399.99. Problem with declining sales is the high cost of buying communist Chinese made stuff. People are spending their sports money elsewhere. Ski industry in the 80’s went thru it. THEY had the snow boarders to make a resurgence. What does the golf industry have. A little Asian working in a rice paddy? That is where they think the money is going to flow from. It will take many years to replace the US golf market(as bad as it is now)

      The one thing I really agree with.. The OEM’s are totally TONE DEAF. The new CEO at Taylor is a bigger moron than the one he is replacing. I have always maintained… the dumbest people in business… run the whole golf industry.

      James Baker.. you gave us all the wrongs.. JUST what would you do to change it all. Remember it is your company.. your money and all the changes you want to do must be business and customer friendly. Easy to pipe off with the wrongs. But how about some of “in their shoes SOLUTIONS”

      Reply

      golfercraig

      9 years ago

      “James Baker.. you gave us all the wrongs.. JUST what would you do to change it all. Remember it is your company.. your money and all the changes you want to do must be business and customer friendly. Easy to pipe off with the wrongs. But how about some of “in their shoes SOLUTIONS””

      Perfect. That is always my complaint when the talk of everything that is wrong comes up. Go ahead–open your own store. Clearly the guy making $10/hr, that “never knew too much about the day to day happenings at headquarters” has all the answers.

      Reply

      Brad

      9 years ago

      “It’s going to mean higher prices and fewer discounts for the consumer, but it also means a healthier bottom line for both retailers and the golf companies.”

      None of that sounds like a benefit to the consumer. The big box wal mart model benefits no one but the Corporation and the Upper tier execs back pockets

      Reply

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